Agree To Disagree

We usually see eye-to-eye… Except when we don’t! See if you find yourself siding with Dan or Joey as we debate a hot topic on this segment of AGREE TO DISAGREE!

Episode 101: How Trends Shape and Influence Customer Expectations

Join us as we discuss what the past decade can teach us about the next decade, how a bespoke publisher creates raving fans, and how the future of personal information is going to get even more messy.

Curation, Creation, and Contention – Oh My!

[Book Report] Understanding How Shifting Trends Can Impact Your Business

As individuals and businesses transition from decade to decade, they often spend time in reflection and evaluation of where they have been, where they are, and where they are going. Rarely do they make the time however to consider their positioning in a shifting global landscape.

Joey and Dan are both fans of their friend Rohit Bhargava and his newest book, Non Obvious Megatrends: How to See What Others Miss and Predict the Future. In his book, Bhargava explores a variety of trends that he sees changing and sculpting the world today. He then outlines a process to help you think in terms of these trends and apply them to your own business.

For example, one of the emerging trends is Revivalism – which Bhargava describes as follows:

Overwhelmed by technology and a sense that life is now too complex and shallow, people seek out simpler experiences that offer a sense of nostalgia and remind them of a more trustworthy time.

Rohit Bhargava, author of Non Obvious Megatrends: How to See What Others Miss and Predict the Future

CX professionals should consider how this trend of customers seeking “simpler experiences with a sense of nostalgia” can influence their organization’s product and service offerings.

Another trend Bhargava explores that is particularly relevant to customer experience is “The Human Mode.” He explains that this trend stems from the rise of artificial intelligence and creates a world where human interaction is increasingly valued as a luxury. Bhargava shares how humanity and vulnerability can be emphasized by blending a sense of empathy into products and processes. Interesting enough, this is exactly the type of messaging that caught Joey’s eye while walking through the airport and seeing an advertisement emphasizing humans over robots (see Episode 96).

From amplified identity, to instant knowledge, to data abundance, to flux commerce, Non Obvious Megatrends explores shifting customer behaviors and expectations that every business should be pay attention to and incorporate into their offerings. If you’re ready to deep dive into these topics and apply them to your business, go buy Non Obvious Megatrends today!

[Dissecting the Experience] Making Things Beautiful Rockets Your Business Forward

As it turns out, sometimes you can judge a book by it’s cover. The fascinating Boulder, Colorado-based company Juniper Books is committed to making your bookshelves more beautiful. They design book covers for books that have already been written in order to better showcase their story from your shelf.

Based on several experiences as a Juniper Books customer, Joey learned several maxims that can be applied to any business in order to enhance the customers’ experiences.

Beautiful design should be incorporated into every product and service you offer. Juniper Books takes existing books and gives them more beautiful covers so that the books jump of the shelf visually.

Find creative ways to do more business with your current customers. Juniper Books keeps loyal fans immersed in growing their book collections by offering a subscription for “Books Everyone Should Own” – a series of classic books with refreshed, unique covers.

Make each customer feel like they are the most important customer. When Joey placed a bulk order of the book, For the Love of Books by Juniper Books founder Thatcher Wine, Wine personalized every copy to add a special touch for the recipients to which Joey gifted the book.

P.S. To see Juniper Books in action, check out the GORGEOUS “coffee table must-have” For the Love of Books by Juniper Books founder Thatcher Wine (disclosure: Thatcher and Joey are friends – but Joey loved his work long before he met Thatcher in person!)

[Agree to Disagree] The Benefits and Costs of More Convenience

In every home and office around the world, shifting expectations reveal an ongoing battle: do we share our private information to achieve greater convenience, or do we protect our information and retain our privacy? While there are certainly advantages and disadvantages to both approaches, it’s not a simple “do it” or “don’t do it” decision for most individuals and organizations.

The Case in Favor of Privacy

  1. Limits the Power of Governments and Corporations – Whoever has the data, has the power. The more information we relinquish, the more likely it is to be used to manipulate our decisions, attitudes, and behaviors.
  2. Respects the Individual – When identity or private information is stolen, abused, or even mis-used, it disrespects the individual.
  3. Allows for Second Chances – Thanks to the “always on, often recorded” digital footprint of today, young people growing up online have every misstep and mistake cataloged for future review and analysis. This seems to accelerate expectations while offering little room for evolving thoughts or even honest mistakes.

The Case in Favor of Convenience

  1. Saves You Time – the one thing that we can’t produce more of is time. By sharing your likes, dislikes, past preferences, and past actions, organizations tracking your data can serve up realtime solutions and product offerings that save you countless hours of searching and remembering.
  2. Allows You to Think Less. When things like account numbers, passwords, and even past food orders are saved and cataloged, you don’t need to devote much active thought to navigating the details and minutia of your day. Things are taken care of and remembered for you.
  3. Makes Life Easier. When items can be ordered, used, re-ordered, and delivered without your direct involvement, life is just easier. Simplification of interactions makes continuing to do business with a company much easier.

As you consider your own habits and behaviors, don’t forget to apply these concepts to your business. What are you doing to make your customer experience more convenient? And, what are you doing to protect your customers’ privacy?

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Episode Transcript

Download a transcript of the entire Episode 101 here or read it below:

Dan Gingiss: Welcome to Experience This.

Joey Coleman: Where you’ll find inspiring examples of customer experience, great stories of customer service and tips on how to make your customers love you even more.

Dan Gingiss: Always upbeat and definitely entertaining, customer-retention expert, Joey Coleman…

Joey Coleman: … and social media expert, Dan Gingiss, serve as your hosts for a weekly dose of positive customer experience.

Dan Gingiss: Hold on to your headphones. It’s time to experience this.

Joey Coleman: Get ready for another episode of the Experience This Show.

Dan Gingiss: Join us as we discuss what the past decade can teach us about the next decade, how a bespoke publisher creates raving fans and how the future of personal information is going to get even more messy.

Joey Coleman: Curation, creation, and contention, oh, my!

[Book Report] MegaTrends

Joey Coleman:   We are excited to give you an overview of an important book you should know about as well as share some of our favorite passages as part of our next book report. As you reflect on the past decade and look forward to the next decade, we found a great resource to help you think bigger about the trends that are shaping the world. Let’s listen to my great friend and prolific author, Rohit Bhargava, as he describes his newest book.

Rohit Bhargava: Hey. This is Rohit Bhargava, and I wrote a book called Non‑Obvious Megatrends, which is all about how to see the world a little bit differently and how to put the pieces together across multiple industries and really do what I think we need to do a little bit more of in the world, which is be more open-minded and read the things that we don’t agree with and try and think for ourselves, and so the book outlines a process to do that, something that I call non-obvious thinking, and then it spotlights 10 different megatrends that I believe are changing the world and our culture and how we believe what we believe in and how we choose to buy or sell certain things, and one of the megatrends that I think is really relevant particularly when it comes to customer experience is a trend that I called human mode.

Rohit Bhargava: Human mode was a response to the idea that, in a world where we have more and more automation and we see more technology coming, we believe in and trust each other and the human power, and so human mode is partially about this idea that, in a situation where we have human contact, we treat that as a luxury and we choose to engage with people more, and we’re sometimes willing to even pay more for that, but the other side of it is that we expect that the things that we buy and the things that we consume are made with more empathy and are made in more human ways, and so one of the ideas that I really challenge people to think of is, instead of just looking at something that’s put out and saying that’s made in the USA or that’s made in Italy, what if we put it out that something was made with empathy? What would that look like?

Rohit Bhargava: A great example is what Starbucks has been doing across a couple of different locations where they employ entirely deaf or hearing-impaired workers in a particular location, and they have one of these in D.C. near where I live, near Gallaudet University, and it’s fascinating because not only are they doing something that is amazing for the community there, but, people who go in, whether they’re hearing impaired or not, are now trying to order their drinks using sign language, and I think that that’s what starts to happen. When we create these human experiences, we become more human ourselves, and that’s what I really love about that trend, so that’s one megatrend. There’s nine others, but I think there’s a lot of relationship between experiences, and, ultimately, what the book is about is trying to get you to think a little bit differently about the world, so I hope you enjoy it.

Dan Gingiss: When we first asked Rohit to share an overview of his book and talk about a trend that he thought specifically applied to customer experience, we actually had no idea that he was going to talk about the Starbucks near Gallaudet University where the staff is entirely deaf or hearing impaired.

Dan Gingiss: You may remember that we discussed this exact same Starbucks in episode 42 way back in season two of the show, so it was fun to hear him talk about that, and I want to just tell you, Joey, that, this morning, when I got my Starbucks, I noticed that the manager of the store had business cards out where you went to collect your coffee and the business cards had braille on them, and I thought that was really cool.

Joey Coleman: Oh, wow, that’s so cool. I love it. It seems like, Dan, maybe we’re trend spotters. We’re early on it. I like it.

Dan Gingiss: What do you mean it seems like? Of course, we are.

Joey Coleman: Yeah. Yes, to be honest, I’ve been a huge fan of Rohit and his work for over a decade now, and this book is filled with ideas, trends and concepts that every business should be considering if they want to be around 10 years from now. My favorite passage from the book comes from the trend revivalism, and it reads as follows. “Overwhelmed by technology and a sense that life is now too complex and shallow, people seek out simpler experiences that offer a sense of nostalgia and remind them of a more trustworthy time.”

Joey Coleman: Now, to be honest, not only have I seen this behavior in the marketplace, I’ve actually felt myself feeling and acting this way more and more. I’m comforted by movies that I watched as a kid. I find myself pausing to listen to songs that were popular when I was coming of age. I’m increasingly more interested in spending time with old friends just chatting instead of seeking out new acquaintances while participating in activities.

Joey Coleman: I think I like this trend because I’m actually living this trend, but what about you, Dan? What was your favorite part of the book?

Dan Gingiss: I’d be remiss if I didn’t say I’m very happy that I’m in the old-friend category…

Joey Coleman: Yes, you are.

Dan Gingiss: … given that last time statement.

Joey Coleman: I’ve known Dan for a very long time, over 20 years at this point, and, yeah, you will be part of my revivalism trend.

Dan Gingiss: Thank goodness. I also definitely got into this book, thanks to Joey’s recommendation, and especially the way that Rohit illustrates the trends by telling interesting stories from around the world, and it’s really more of a global review, and we have been, I have been accused in times of having a US-centric view, which makes sense, I live in the United States, but I think it’s really important to know what’s going on globally on both a micro and a macro level.

Joey Coleman: To that point, Dan, if I may interrupt, folks, if you’re listening to the show and you don’t live in the United States, we would love to hear from you. Go to Click on the contact page, and there’s an orange button that, if you press it, it says, “Start recording.” If you press that, you can leave us a message. Tell us about a brand you’ve had an experience with. Tell us about how customer experience in your country or in your community is different. We would love to feature more international information and international stories on the show. It’s just that, sometimes, it’s more difficult for Dan and I to gather those and bring them back.

Dan Gingiss: Agreed, so I picked a passage as well, and my… My favorite passage came from the trend attention wealth, and here’s the quote. “Share your backstory. To break through the noise, share your backstory, letting customers know why and how you do what you do. Luxury brand Hermès, for example, launched a film that takes consumers inside one of its silk mills in Lyon, France, to illustrate how its products are made. If you can share your story in an interesting way, showing your craft or trade with humility and vulnerability, you might be able to interest current customers or, potentially, new ones to spend more time and money with you.”

Joey Coleman: I love it. In a book about future trends, we’re talking about telling your backstory in a more compelling fashion. Since the first humans walked the planet, we’ve gathered around the fire to tell stories about our experiences, and I find it ironic and, to be honest, encouraging that everything that is old is becoming new again.

Dan Gingiss: There’s your nostalgic revivalism again, isn’t it?

Joey Coleman: Look how it’s coming out. I love it. I definitely feel like I’ve identified the trend that most applies to me. Folks, there are incredible trends to explore in this book, including amplified identity, instant knowledge, data abundance, flux commerce and so many more that we’ve alluded to on this show over the past five seasons.

Joey Coleman: If you want to really dive deep into these fascinating topics and see how they can be applied to your business or industry, look no further than Rohit Bhargava’s final installment of his Trend Series, the book titled Non-Obvious Megatrends, How to See What Others Miss and Predict the Future. It will really change how you see the world. Please press pause on this podcast right now and go order a copy of the book. It’s entertaining. It’s actionable, and it’ll help you stay relevant and successful in the crazy decade to come.

[Dissecting the Experience] Juniper Books

Dan Gingiss: Sometimes, a remarkable experience deserves deeper investigation.

Joey Coleman: We dive into the nitty-gritty of customer interactions and dissect how and why they happen. Join us while we’re dissecting the experience.

Joey Coleman: We absolutely love books here on the Experience This Show, books about customer experience, books about customer service, nonfiction books, fiction books, old books, new books and, yes, even books about books, which is how I got introduced to a fantastic company right here in my hometown of Boulder, Colorado, called Juniper Books. I met the impressive CEO, Thatcher Wine, who, yes, lives up to his impressive name as well, at an event where he publicly shared his personal story from the stage. Then I got to spend some time with him at a few different fundraisers because our children attend the same school. Then I read his fantastic magnum opus, For the Love of Books, Designing and Curating a Home Library, and then I started doing business with his company.

Dan Gingiss: All right, I’m intrigued. What does his company do?

Joey Coleman: I’m happy to tell you, Dan, but, to get the full experience, I think it’d be useful to share a little backstory about Juniper Books. It was founded by Thatcher Wine in 2001, and Thatcher had always loved reading and collecting books, and he began his career sourcing one-of-a-kind and rare book collections for clients around the world. A few years later, he invented the concept of a custom book jacket, designing beautiful, engaging, aesthetically pleasing covers for incredible books, so they take a great book that’s already been written and design a new cover that you put on it that is more artful and more engaging. Today, Juniper Books works with thousands of customers in over 50 countries, helping them fall in love with books all over again.

Dan Gingiss: I have a confession to make. I have read maybe two E-books in my entire life…

Joey Coleman: Really?

Dan Gingiss: … because I still like having a physical book. It’s one of those things I just can’t trade in, and I used to, my first job out of college, I worked for this high-end collectibles company that had three different divisions, and one of them was called the Easton Press. The Easton Press is known for its beautiful leather-bound books.

Joey Coleman: Beautiful books, yeah, I’m very familiar with it.

Dan Gingiss: As an employee, I got a pretty sweet discount on these books…

Joey Coleman: Oh, nice.

Dan Gingiss: … and I subscribed to a couple of the collections, the most popular one being the 100 Greatest Books Ever Written, and they come in these just gorgeous bindings, and they look so great, and more than one person told me that my bookshelf made me look smarter, and I was like, “Even if I haven’t read all these books?” and they’re like, “Yeah, just having them on your shelf makes you look smarter.”

Joey Coleman: Yeah, and we talked earlier in the season about my buddy, Ryan Holiday, who is a prolific writer and reader, and one of the things he advocates very publicly is don’t feel bad about buying books that you haven’t read yet, that there’s something to be said for being surrounded by books and what that does to your brain and what that does to your commitment to growth and learning, and so I absolutely love that you have that collection.

Joey Coleman: It’s interesting, I love going to people’s homes and looking at the books they have and also looking at how people arrange books, which, if you’re interested in how you present your book collection, you’ve got to check out Thatcher’s book because it’s all about designing the bookshelves and the bookcases at your home. It’s this colorful coffee table book, so to speak, that is so rich in imagery and detail and suggestions. It’s absolutely fantastic.

Joey Coleman: Allow me if I may to share their mission from their website, because I think this helps to give everyone the full picture of what Juniper Books is all about. Juniper Books is dedicated to elevating the printed book by enhancing its design quality and aesthetic, deepening the meaning of books in our lives and facilitating the connection between the stories books tell us and the stories they tell about us. We chose the name Juniper Books for a reason. Juniper trees live for up to a thousand years. Printed books have been around for 500 years, and we’re doing our part to make sure they are around for at least 500 more.

Dan Gingiss: I love it, so you mentioned that you did business with them, and, based on what you’ve shared already, it wouldn’t surprise me if the experience was as impressive as what they do with their books.

Joey Coleman: You are correct as usual, my friend, so there were three interactions that I had that particularly stood out, and I thought it’d be interesting for us to discuss these as underlying principles that can and should be applied to every company. First, the products and services you offer should be beautifully designed. Juniper Books takes books that have already been written, books that already have jackets, and it redesigns them to be artwork for your shelf.

Joey Coleman: How many times have you read a book and realize that, when it’s sitting on your shelf, the appearance doesn’t do justice to what you know is inside the book on the pages? Juniper Books breathes new life into products that people already love, and it encourages them to display their collections in a way that encourages others to then ask about the books they have.

Dan Gingiss: I can definitely see how that can apply to other businesses. I mean, design and aesthetics matter a lot more than people think. Often, I’ll use a product and think this is a really good product, but it doesn’t stand out in any way for its design. If you look at brands like Apple, Mercedes, Lululemon, they have really brought design sensibility to functional product offerings, but many companies still skip that design part when they’re thinking about how to package or present their offerings.

Joey Coleman: It’s so true, Dan, and, to be honest, in 2020, it shocks me how many businesses aren’t evaluating the look and feel of their offerings and figuring out how to make them more beautiful, but there’s opportunities for growth. The second thing that businesses should consider is how can I do more business with my most loyal fans? Now, the typical business I think approaches this by asking, “How can I sell them more?” Juniper Books seems to have answered this question by asking, “How can I make them collect more?”

Joey Coleman: You see, people that buy books are often collectors of books without realizing that they’re collectors, and so Juniper created a subscription offering called Books Everyone Should Own, and I just love the name of it because it implies that, if you love books, you better subscribe to this because there may be books in it that you should own that you don’t, and they don’t tell you what the books are. It’s a subscription that comes every month over the mail. Now, Thatcher curates the books that are in this set, and they are timeless novels that are then mailed to the subscribers with a custom cover that has been designed by Juniper Books.

Dan Gingiss: It is a great name because it also creates this sense of FOMO, or fear of missing out.

Joey Coleman: Of course.

Dan Gingiss: You want to know what the next one is, so I think it is a naturally recurring subscription that, I think, my guess is its retention rate is pretty high on it as well. Any one of those themes that you just described could be applied to most businesses to come up with creative ways to serve their most loyal customers even more.

Dan Gingiss: I would suggest a couple of questions that people should ask themselves about their business. How can you send your products to your customer on a recurring basis? How can you do the hard work of selecting the perfect solution for their needs again and again? How can you combine some of your offerings with other offerings that might not be as obvious to your customers as it is to you, and how can you make your most loyal customers feel special and appreciated?

Joey Coleman: Absolutely, Dan. Instead of focusing on new customers in 2020, what if every business spent at least 50% of their efforts and their budgets and their thinking time devoted to deepening the connection with current customers? I mean, you already know who they are. You know what they like. You know how to reach them. Maybe it’s time to use this information and access, and the relationship that you already have, to build greater rapport and likely do even more business with your raving fans, which actually brings me to the third observation I wanted to make from my experiences with Juniper Books. Always make it personal.

Dan Gingiss: That makes sense. Personalization and customization are pretty regular themes here on our show. How does Juniper Books put their special twist on it?

Joey Coleman: They go above and beyond again and again. When I wanted to purchase a bunch of copies of Thatcher’s gorgeous book, For the Love of Books, to give to some friends that are crazy book fans, he kindly personalized each book and then carefully packaged them so I could mail them around the world in an easy and convenient way. When I wanted to give a gift subscription that was off schedule of the monthly subscription, so I was buying it at a time where it was going to be awhile before the first book hit, his design team created a custom card that was absolutely beautiful that I could send to the recipient while they were waiting to get their first book, so, with every turn, Juniper Books goes above and beyond with their commitment to aesthetics and design to create these personalized experiences that make me feel like I’m the most valuable customer they have.

Dan Gingiss: That’s really all you can ask from a company that you do business with and, as long as they continue making you feel that special, you’re going to keep coming back and buying more.

Joey Coleman: It’s so true, so what can you do to take the spirit of Juniper Books and use it to foster connection with your customers? First, make sure your offerings are beautifully designed, then get creative on ways to do even more business with your biggest fans and, finally, never stop making your individual customers feel like they are the most important person to your business.

[Agree to Disagree] Privacy vs. Convenience

Joey Coleman: We usually see eye to eye except when we don’t. See if you find yourself siding with Dan or Joey as we debate a hot topic on this segment of agree to disagree.

Dan Gingiss: There is a battle raging inside businesses, homes and even the minds of individuals almost every day. It’s something that many people are skirting around, but few are really addressing or considering. In a world where the more data we share, the less friction we experience, in a world where the more we give up, the more we seem to get, in a world where the more we provide, the less we struggle, Joey, which do you think is more important, privacy or convenience?

Joey Coleman: Wow, that’s a tough one, Dan, and, to be honest, I want to answer your question, but I’m not sure that it’s an either-or decision. I mean, there are certainly times when I guard my privacy stringently and there are other times when I will happily volunteer my personal details. There are times when I revel in a frictionless interaction and, of course, there are definitely times where I’ll happily experience less because I’m not willing to share more, and so, if I had to pick, and I guess I had to since this is an agree-to-disagree episode, I’m going to have to go with privacy being more important than convenience.

Joey Coleman: I mean, I believe this for a few reasons. Number one, it limits the power of governments and corporations. Let’s be honest, whoever has the data is in charge, and, while they incentivize you to give up your privacy and share your data to make your life easier, they don’t tell you all the things they’re going to do with your data, who they’re going to sell it to, how they’re going to protect it and how they’re going to use it to subconsciously manipulate you to do things that are in their best interest, but not necessarily in yours.

Dan Gingiss: My friend, this is an agree-to-disagree segment, so, probably not surprising to our listeners, I’m going to choose convenience and not just to say that it’s more important, but to really say, in my life, it’s something that I just genuinely stress more because I, like many individuals, probably don’t pay as much attention to privacy as I should.

Dan Gingiss: The number one thing that I think is important with convenience is that it saves you time. It’s the one resource that we can’t make more of, and I know because you and I have talked about this. We’re very busy people. We work late into the night. If we could work 28-hour days, we surely would do it every once in a while, but we can’t, and so anything that saves me time has so much value to me that I’m likely willing to give up a lot for it in terms of different resources, money and privacy being two of them.

Joey Coleman: Fair enough, and I absolutely appreciate that and I enjoy the convenience, and I love the idea of having more time, but you know what I love even more? I love myself, and I don’t mean that from a place of ego. At the end of the day, privacy allows people to keep things for themselves. I mean, some people’s desire for privacy is brushed away because we have this view in society that it’s not that big of a deal if your information gets leaked or if we get some of your information. I mean, privacy is trivial, but the reality is, even if there isn’t a huge impact when details about your private life are shared more broadly, not honoring someone’s privacy demonstrates a lack of respect for the person. It demonstrates a lack of respect for their individuality. It really says, “I care more about my interest than your interest, so I want to know as much about you as possible, and then I’m going to use that to my advantage.”

Dan Gingiss: I certainly do believe that companies have an obligation to protect our privacy. I think one of the reasons I fall on the convenience side is because my expectation as a consumer is that companies are doing that. Now, no doubt, no doubt-

Joey Coleman: Sorry. Sorry. I got to interrupt. Your expectation, when all we hear on the news is breach after breach, when you’ve worked corporate America, you know what a nightmare their protections are. You’re confident that they’re going to do that?

Dan Gingiss: I didn’t say I was confident. I said it was my expectation. A lot of companies-

Joey Coleman: On a scale of one to 10, with one being they’re abysmal and 10 being they’re amazing, where do you fall on what you think the average company is doing with respect to that?

Dan Gingiss: In terms of meeting my expectations…

Joey Coleman: Yes.

Dan Gingiss: … or meeting your expectation? Some of them do it much better than others.

Joey Coleman: Oh, ladies and gentlemen, for those of you paying attention at home, that is the sound of Dan giving a score that is less than three, but not wanting to say a number that is less than three.

Dan Gingiss: Maybe, but I will say another thing on the side of convenience is sometimes I just don’t want to think about it. One of the problems with privacy is having to think a lot about passwords and other types of things. The number of, the amount of time I spend resetting passwords because I can’t remember all of the details that I’ve been asked individually because this company will allow an exclamation point and this one will only allow an asterisk and this one needs two numbers and whatever, it’s a huge waste of time, whereas the convenience factor allows me to actually think less. I mean, who wants to sit and have to remember to order paper towels or tissues or, hey, let’s go with something that might be private, hemorrhoid ointment, right? I’d rather just have somebody else take care of it for me and have the convenience and prioritize that first.

Joey Coleman: I find it fascinating that you used the word think so much in that justification of why you think convenience is more valuable because I feel the same way about privacy in the sense that I love privacy because it protects me on the times when maybe I didn’t think, so I believe that humans should be given the benefit of the doubt. I believe that humans should be forgiven. I believe that humans should be given second chances, and, when everything that we do is available publicly to the world and where things that we’ve done in the past where maybe we didn’t think it through and make the good choice gets dragged into the present to potentially be used against us, that to me is a huge argument in favor of privacy.

Joey Coleman: I mean, I’ll be candid, I’ve got a six-year-old and a four-year-old. I worry about the world they’re growing up in where there’s an expectation that they will live their lives online, where there’s an expectation that the stupid thing they say could be caught on video. The stupid thing they do could be caught on video and, 30 years down the road in a job interview, based on a Google search, that could be dragged up and used against them to not get a job, not get a promotion, not be able to get a date, fill in the blanks of the consequence.

Joey Coleman: I don’t know about you. I’ll just speak for myself. I am very, very happy that there is not video footage or a record of some of the stupid things I did as I was moving from, oh, let’s say age zero the present.

Dan Gingiss: I do think that you can in some ways control this. There are people that aren’t on Facebook and that aren’t… that don’t have a digital presence really to speak of. There are people that you can Google and get pretty much no results, believe it or not.

Joey Coleman: Sure.

Dan Gingiss: I made a choice awhile back to become active in social media understanding that that puts some privacy to risk, but I also try to control that by, for example, only posting pictures of my kids on Facebook where I’m only connected to friends and people that I know versus, on Twitter, where I’m connected to tens of thousands of people who I don’t know and haven’t met and don’t know if they’re even real people, so there is that piece of it, but also I think, unfortunately, we live in a world today where, despite your best efforts, somebody could still pull that old yearbook photo of you being a class clown or you writing something as we saw in a recent Supreme Court nominee’s situation that… and bring it online today, and that’s just a fact of our lives, and so, in today’s world, we have given up some privacy whether we want to or not, and, yes, is that sad? I think it is, but I think it is absolutely the life that we live today.

Dan Gingiss: The one other thing that I’ll push for in convenience is that Shep Hyken wrote a book about it, and I think that should be enough reason.

Joey Coleman: It’s a great book…

Dan Gingiss: That’s a book that we talked about.

Joey Coleman: … and that’s a great reason to be a fan of convenience.

Dan Gingiss: Yes, we talked about this book, I believe it was last season, called The Convenience Revolution, and, obviously, what he says in here is that convenience is one of the biggest parts of customer experience and one of the biggest ways to get people to like doing business with you.

Dan Gingiss: Now, to be fair, later this season, spoiler alert, we’re also going to highlight an article where he talks about fraud having an impact on the customer experience, and fraud is often the result of people, nefarious people, hackers, et cetera, violating somebody’s privacy, so they’re both pretty critical.

Joey Coleman: Fair enough. I think, at the end of the day, I want to come back to something that you said as an aside early on, and the recovering attorney in me doesn’t want to use your words against you, but I will to win this debate. You said, “I probably think about privacy less than I should,” and I think, at the end of the day, that’s my big issue. My big issue is that, the corporations, your government, they aren’t thinking about your privacy at all.

Joey Coleman: Most humans aren’t thinking about their privacy nearly enough because they’re over-indexing on their desire for convenience, and I think we have only begun to experience the tip of the iceberg of the consequence of these choices of not thinking more specifically and more comprehensively about the information in the data that we’re sharing and how that giving up of our privacy may come back to bite us in the future.

Dan Gingiss: Joey, since my lunch has just arrived, conveniently delivered by a driver, I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

Joey Coleman: Agree to disagree. Wow. Thanks for joining us for another episode of Experience This.

Dan Gingiss: We know there are tons of podcasts to listen to, magazines and books to read, reality TV to watch. We don’t take for granted that you’ve decided to spend some quality time listening to the two of us.

Joey Coleman: We hope you enjoyed our discussions, and, if you do, we’d love to hear about it. Come on over to we and let us know what segments you enjoyed, what new segments you’d like to hear. This show is all about experience, and we want you to be part of the Experience This Show.

Dan Gingiss: Thanks again for your time, and we’ll see you next week for more…

Joey Coleman: … Experience…

Dan Gingiss: … This.

Episode 79: Customers Like to Share Their Remarkable Experiences

Join us as we discuss: A plethora of positive customer experience stories, a debate about all of those subscription boxes, and a man who creates music on the fly.

Sharing, Shaving, and Singing – Oh My!

[Listener Stories] Positive Experiences Get Shared More than Negative Experiences

When was the last time you had a remarkable experience? According to our friends at the Sitel Group, 30% of people will share when they have a negative customer experience. But, statistics show that nearly 50% of consumers will speak about a positive experience! Dan wanted to test these percentages, so he asked his Facebook friends to share a remarkable customer experience.

From OtterBox replacing cases with no questions asked, to Wegmans Food Markets calling to let a customer know that an item purchased weeks ago was recalled, the stories poured in. In each shared example, companies went above and beyond to make things right for their customers – without asking questions.

When our customers don’t even have to ask for our help and we acknowledge that something might have gone wrong, that’s how you create a customer for life. That’s how you create the kind of connection and interaction that will not only keep that customer loyal, but they will want to tell that story again and again!

Joey Coleman, co-host of ExperienceThis! Show podcast

We’d love to hear about your remarkable experiences! Click here to share your experience in our contact form or record a digital voicemail for us by clicking on the “Start Recording” button.

[Agree to Disagree] There’s a Subscription for That

The very mention of “subscription services” brings thoughts of glee or dread – depending on what you are signing up to receive! In the past, “subscription” referred to magazines, papers, and maybe a mail-delivery music or movie club. In recent years, online subscriptions have exploded and now represent a huge industry in the United States and around the world. There are subscription services for razors, dive bar shirts, and socks – just to name a few. Why do consumers enjoy subscription services?

  • Save Money – Joey likes subscription services that help customers save money like those offered by Chewy Autoship and Amazon Subscribe and Save. Dan doesn’t like these types of subscriptions because they make him spend MORE money.
  • Experience Convenience – Subscriptions allow customers to “set it and forget it.” The problem arises when you completely forget the subscription and end up paying for something you no longer need or use.
  • Get Access to New Product – Valued customers can get access to new products before they are released to the public. On the other hand, how many products is too many?!

[Start the Conversation] Avtex: Technology’s Key Role in Customer Experience

Technology is integrated into almost every single interaction a customer has with any business. However, the amount of antiquated software out there is astounding. It’s important to ensure that the CX technologies you use are up to date and won’t negatively impact your customers’ interactions. Here are five technologies that could use a thorough and objective assessment to see if they are up to the task of delivering remarkable customer experiences:

  1. Contact Center platforms
  2. Customer Relationship Management (CRM) tools
  3. Employee productivity tools
  4. Data and analytics solutions
  5. Middleware and integration-supporting applications

Start the conversation with this question: Do our current technology platforms adequately support our CX strategy?

To continue the conversation, go to:

[Dissecting the Experience] Create a Remarkable Experience Even When You Feel a Little Unprepared

When you attend a national speaker’s conference, you never know who will strike up a conversation! In an elevator at the National Speakers Association annual meeting, Dan met Harold Payne, a multi-platinum singer-songwriter who is also a master improviser. Harold improvises songs for the clients and conferences where he presents and was kind enough to create one for our show that you can listen to here.

When we think about customer experience, I think that’s often what it’s about: just creating a moment, creating a memory, creating something that when the individual who’s been to your event or your office goes back home, they remember an experience they can bring back to share with their friends.

Joey Coleman, co-host of Experience This! Show podcast

By creating something special for your clients, you give them something to remember and to share.

Links We Referenced

Host Contact Information

Email Dan:

Tweet Dan Gingiss: @DGingiss

Email Joey:

Subscribe to Experience This on Apple Podcasts

Episode Transcript

Download a transcript of the entire Episode 79 here or read it below:

Dan Gingiss: Welcome to Experience This.

Joey Coleman: Where you’ll find inspiring examples of customer experience, great stories of customer service, and tips on how to make your customers love you even more.

Dan Gingiss: Always upbeat and definitely entertaining, customer attention expert, Joey Coleman.

Joey Coleman: And social media expert, Dan Gingiss, serve as your hosts for a weekly dose of positive customer experience.

Dan Gingiss: So hold onto your headphones. It’s time to Experience This!

Joey Coleman: Get ready for another episode of the Experience This Show.

Dan Gingiss: Join us as we discuss a veritable plethora of positive customer experience stories, a debate about all those subscription boxes and a man who creates music on the fly.

Joey Coleman: Sharing, shaving, and singing. Oh my.

LISTENER STORIES: One Question on Facebook

You listened to us, now we want to listen to you. By visiting our website and sharing your remarkable customer experiences with us. We can share them with a broader audience. Now, sit back and enjoy our listener stories.

Dan Gingiss: One of the statistics I like to share in my keynote presentations actually comes from our friends at Sytel Group, and it’s that while 30% of consumers say they’d share a bad customer experience on social media, nearly half of consumers say the exact same thing about a positive experience. This presents a huge opportunity for companies to start intentionally creating more positive experiences so their customers can’t wait to talk about them with friends and family. Now full disclosure, that’s what my keynote is about, how to do that. But for this segment, I wanted to see what would happen if I asked a simple question on Facebook. What was the last remarkable experience you had with a company? And boy, my friends did not disappoint.

Joey Coleman: Well Dan, you know I’m not nearly as much of a social media guy as you are, but I saw your post and I also know that our mutual friend Jay Baer talks about how half of word of mouth marketing is still offline. So getting people to talk positively about your brand can have effects both on and off social media.

Dan Gingiss: Exactly right, my friend Joey. So are you ready to hear some of the great experiences that I got from this single question?

Joey Coleman: I am and I’m excited to be able to share those because I must confess, I was surprised when I saw it by the number of people who commented. It was pretty nice.

Dan Gingiss: Exactly.

Joey Coleman: It warms my heart.

Dan Gingiss: That it’s great, so I appreciate that you read it as well so we’ll share them together back and forth.

Joey Coleman: Perfect.

Dan Gingiss: So my friend Sandy responded by saying that Bombas sent seven pairs of socks instead of the eight that she ordered. “The customer service department was swamped and they were unable to respond within the timeframe promised. They not only refunded my entire purchase amount, but issued me a $50 gift card for a future purchase.”

Joey Coleman: Nice. Jamie said OtterBox, “They will provide you with a new phone case if yours get stretched out or cracked. No questions asked.”

Dan Gingiss: Love OtterBox had them as a guest on my last podcast and I’m a frequent user of their products. My friend [Katie 00:03:26] said, “Glossier had apparently discovered an issue with the pigment changing in some makeup that I bought. I had not noticed any issues. They both refunded my money and sent me a new bottle once they’d fixed the issue.”

Joey Coleman: Margaret shared that Wegmans called her house to tell her that a bag of flour she bought weeks ago had been recalled.

Dan Gingiss: That one stunned me by the way.

Joey Coleman: Yeah, weeks ago.

Dan Gingiss: Yeah. and a single item in a cart.

Joey Coleman: A single item.

Dan Gingiss: Yeah. Fantastic.

Joey Coleman: Impressive.

Dan Gingiss: So a friend named Dan, this is not me.

Joey Coleman: Not Dan. We’re not just making it up, folks. It’s a different friend.

Dan Gingiss: A friend named Dan said, “I was processing payroll while our HR manager was on vacation.”

Joey Coleman: Oh, lucky-

Dan Gingiss: Dan, yes.

Joey Coleman: … Oh, what a great gig.

Dan Gingiss: “A unique situation came up, so I called ADP for help. The person quickly understood what was needed, entered it into our payroll system so I didn’t have to do it and potentially screw it up and double-checked the information. It was a lifesaver and I didn’t have to bother my HR manager on her vacation.”

Joey Coleman: Ooh, I want to clap that one. That was nice yeah.

Dan Gingiss: Great B2B example also. .

Joey Coleman: For those of you that are like, well, what about B2B? B2B, B2C, it’s all H2H people, human to human. Okay. Stacy shared that All-Clad, replaced two of her ten-year-old nonstick pans because they’d lost their nonstick. She received two brand new pans just last week. No questions asked.

Dan Gingiss: And Lisa G. Said, “The car dealer who offered to send a driver with my mom’s car to her house to swap out her repaired car for the loner because he knows how tough it is for me to get an additional aid to stay with my mom when there are car issues.”

Joey Coleman: Oh, I love it. Human touch. Jeffery shares, “I was at Whole Foods in the checkout line. An item I had from the Butcher Block, 1.5 pounds of pork chops wasn’t scanning out correctly because the barcode was faded. The cashier called them and told them to change out the toner on the scale. He proceeded to place the pork chops in my bag.” I asked him how much and he said they’re free today because of the inconvenience of waiting for them to change out the toner. When in our lifetimes can we actually cry out free pork chops, and have it ring true?”

Dan Gingiss: Now that’s a good day. Julia said, “Bentley’s Pet Store called me within 24 hours letting me know they overcharged me for my purchase by 50% and offered a credit. I would have never known. Love them.”

Joey Coleman: And finally Lisa B. shares, “I emailed Zappos to let them know that the Nike’s I bought for my daughter had a hole after a month of wear. They refunded my entire purchase without me needing to return the shoes.”

Dan Gingiss: So why are we sharing all of these stories? It’s to show that a number of brands in both B2C and B2B, that’s business to consumer and business to business, for those not in the know, are starting to figure this customer experience thing out. Which means that if your company hasn’t yet, you’re behind the competition. It’s also to demonstrate that no matter what business you’re in, you can do these kinds of things too.

Joey Coleman: Oh, so true Dan. So true. There is no excuse for not caring about your customers. Most of these examples we just shared were about doing the right thing for the customer. Not making them jump through a lot of hoops to get a refund, and frankly leaving them happier than if they hadn’t had a problem in the first place. It’s really powerful when we can take a momentary interaction with a customer, add a little dash of surprise and delight by giving them something unexpected and then sit back and watch how they tell the story, how they shared that this has been their experience maybe weeks, months later.

Dan Gingiss: I also think it’s really instructive to realize that a number of these examples came from things that went wrong first, right? The price tag wasn’t visible when they went to scan it or the shoes had a hole in it, and they turned into the answer to the question of what’s the last great experience that you had with a brand?

Joey Coleman: Absolutely. I also loved that a number of these examples were things that the customer didn’t actually know something had gone wrong, so the recall on the flour, the overcharging by 50%, this is the business taking a vested interest. If you remember several seasons ago, and I won’t call on our a savant Dan to point out which episode it was, but years ago we talked about an experience I had watching Amazon where my wife and I rented a movie on Amazon and it was buffering slowly and so the movie was a little garbled. And the next day I got an unexpected, unprompted email from Amazon, from their video services department saying, “Hey, we saw that you rented this video. We saw that there were some issues in the bandwidth during delivery, so we’ve credited you back the rental fee for free.” Again, when our customers don’t even have to ask for our help and we acknowledge that something might have gone wrong, that’s how you create a customer for life. That’s how you create the kind of connection and interaction that will not only keep that customer loyal, but they will want to tell that story again and again.

Dan Gingiss: So we’d like to hear your customer stories as well. If you’d do us a favor, go to, click on contact in the upper right hand corner, and you will see a little SpeakPipe widget. And this is basically a digital voicemail where you can leave us a message that will come to our inboxes and tell us about the last time you had a remarkable experience with a brand and your story might just appear in a future episode.

AGREE TO DISAGREE: Subscription Services

Joey Coleman: We usually see eye to eye except when we don’t. See if you find yourself siding with Dan or Joey as we debate a hot topic on this segment of Agree to Disagree.

Dan Gingiss: It used to be that a subscription referred to your daily newspaper or a monthly magazine, then came digital subscriptions like Netflix and Amazon Music. Then there was the Dollar Shave Club. Now you can subscribe to almost anything. The online subscription market more than doubled each year from 2011 to 2016 with the largest players among them generating more than $2.6 billion in 2016 sales, up from just $57 million in 2011 according to McKinsey. You may or may not know that 70% of subscription services are sold in the U.S., the rest of the world only accounts for 30%. There were $1.2 billion in capital investments in subscription services in 2018. It’s estimated to be a 10 plus billion dollar market just in the U.S. And not including Amazon. And the average subscriber has two different services with a third of customers having three or more subscription services. And so we ask is this a good thing?

Joey Coleman: Well, let me say this as a little disclaimer before I make my point. I think there there’s a separate conversation to have here around consumption in the environment and how all that fits in. But if we’re just talking about the concept of a subscription versus non-subscription, I actually think subscription services work really well, for a number of reasons. First and foremost, they save the customer money. So if you’re a part of Amazon Subscribe & Save, or Chewy’s Autoship, everybody wins. The customer pays less. The company providing the subscription has a better idea of what their yield and what they’re through rates need to be so they can better forecast and make better use of their materials and their warehouse time. So overall it saves everybody money.

Number two, a subscription can be incredibly convenient. You can set it and forget it. Now, there are times where this can get a little bit out of control if you set it, forget it, and then all of a sudden you stock up on a lot of stuff you don’t need. But in the best uses of subscription services, you don’t have to remember to go to the store, which is great because let’s be candid, who really gets super excited about going to the store anymore? I know I don’t. I would much rather have it just show up at the house.

Number three, subscription services introduced me to new products and service opportunities that I might not otherwise know about. There’s a real opportunity here I think, to have curated experiences. To have someone else helping you to find the specific choices and expose you to the new possibilities within a subscription category service.

Dan Gingiss: Well Joey, since this segment is called Agree to Disagree, I’m going to have to disagree with you there.

Joey Coleman: Of course you are.

Dan Gingiss: I think subscription services have simply gone too far. First of all, they end up costing you more money because you get stuff that you don’t need. I use Amazon Subscribe & Save, but now I’m up to like $50 or $60 a month in stuff. And I always have to go back and double-check to make sure that I really need this stuff.

Secondly, I think companies are taking advantage of customers who are setting it and forgetting it. Even in the shave clubs and other things, sometimes you get three or four in a row and then you realize, “Well, I’ve got 24 razor blades now I’m going to be just fine shaving for a long, long time,” but it’s a pain to cancel and so people stay on and inertia takes over.

Joey Coleman: Don’t you shave your head every day, man? You go through a lot of razors I’m sure.

Dan Gingiss: It is pretty shiny.

Joey Coleman: It is shiny.

Dan Gingiss: Third, there are simply too many subscriptions out there. It absolutely boggles the mind. There’s the Bacon of the Month Club. There’s the Dive Bar Shirt Club, the Bagel of the Month Club, the Sock of the Month Club. And even one called Cannabox, which will send you cannabis supplies every month.

Joey Coleman: Wait a second. Are all of those real Dan?

Dan Gingiss: These are all real services [crosstalk 00:13:46] that I looked up on worldwide web.

Joey Coleman: No really, the dive bar one?

Dan Gingiss: Yes.

Joey Coleman: The dive bar one? Oh my gosh. Who really is sitting at home going, “Man, I wish I had some more t-shirts from dive bars I haven’t been to.

Dan Gingiss: It actually sounds kind of cool doesn’t it [crosstalk 00:13:58], now that you think about it.

Joey Coleman: It does sound kind of cool now that you think about it. Yeah it does. So I guess I’ve swayed you over them that you actually think it’s a good idea. Ladies and gentlemen, we call that the bait and switch. Dan fell for it. I reeled him in. Now, here’s the thing. I agree with you. If you are going to do subscription services, you have to pay attention to them. You really do because they can get out of control and I know I have suffered from that in the past where I’ve had subscription services and all of a sudden I’ve realized, wait a second, why am I still getting this? It goes from being a convenient way to get the things you need, to an inconvenient way to be billed for stuff you don’t want.

Dan Gingiss: And tell the audience Joey, how many magazine subscriptions you had until just recently?

Joey Coleman: Okay, until very recently I had a small addiction problem, two magazines. I was subscribed to 30 different magazines. Now prior to having children, I will confess I read these 30 magazines every month. I would basically had to read a magazine a day to keep up, but I really liked the format. I liked the tactile feel, I’m a visual learner. Some magazines worked better for me than reading online or just reading an article. I really liked it. But since having kids, I kind of woke up the other day, this is within the last month and realized, you know what, I don’t need to have as many subscriptions as I do. So I’m now down to just three, so I cut it by 90% [crosstalk 00:15:19] which saved a lot of money.

Dan Gingiss: Well the first step is admitting you have a problem Joey.

Joey Coleman: This is true. This is very true and that’s why I said see earlier disclaimer that you have to be responsible for your own subscriptions and not let them get out of control. That being said, as recent parents in the last few years, the fact that the diapers just show up without us having to think about it, that was a very convenient subscription that we will be very excited to not be part of in the near future. But the moral of the story is that worked well for us.

Dan Gingiss: Well, I think the message to companies is … subscriptions right now are a thing. They’re a fad. People are excited about them, they’re a trend. And what often happens is companies think, “Well, if this is trending, it’s something we need to jump on to.” And so what I want to suggest to listeners is, if you don’t have a product that is really relevant for a subscription service, don’t feel like this is a direction that you have to go. That being said, it is obviously a great way to get sustainable revenue from customers because they do set it and forget it, but it doesn’t work for everything. And I believe that there’s certainly some out there that can work really, really well, but that it really has gotten a little bit too far.

Joey Coleman: Well, I think subscription services are great.

Dan Gingiss: Well Joey, then I guess we’ll just have to, agree to disagree.


Joey Coleman: Sometimes all it takes is a single question to get your company thinking about an improved customer experience. Here’s an idea for how you can start the conversation.

Dan Gingiss: This week’s Start the Conversation topic is technology’s key role in customer experience. Technology’s vital role in meeting the changing demands of the modern consumer has long been recognized. Nearly every interaction occurring between a customer and an organization is driven or supported by at least one form of technology, and in many cases multiple platforms converge to support the interaction. Unfortunately, many CX leaders overlook the critical step of ensuring that these technologies are up to the challenge of supporting existing customer experience strategies or newly created experiences. This leaves the CX strategy vulnerable to failure or underperformance and may lead to challenges for both customers and employees.

Joey Coleman: It’s important to conduct a thorough and objective assessment of your customer experience technologies including these five key things. Contact center platforms. Customer relationship management or CRM tools. Employee productivity tools. Data and analytics solutions. Middleware and integration supporting applications.

Dan Gingiss: I have to tell you the Joey, having worked at a number of big companies, it is amazing how much old technology is still out there.

Joey Coleman: Ooh, legacy ware folks, it’s exciting.

Dan Gingiss: I mean stuff that was built in like the early nineties, late eighties.

Joey Coleman: Lotus Notes baby, Lotus Notes for everyone.

Dan Gingiss: Lotus Notes is just fantastic. And the thing is is that today customers expect more than that. Whether it’s a customer-facing piece of technology or it’s something that simply enables a customer experience, it really is important that this stuff gets upgraded for the times because the demand is so much higher today

Joey Coleman: And now for this week’s question about technology’s key role in CX, do our current technology platforms adequately support our customer experience strategy? We encourage you to start the conversation within your own organization and then continue it with Avtex at that’s


Sometimes a remarkable experience deserves deeper investigation. We dive into the nitty-gritty of customer interactions and dissect how and why they happen. Join us while we’re Dissecting the Experience.

Dan Gingiss: No, Joey and I aren’t going to sing for you again, but someone else is. Meet Harold [Pain 00:19:49] , a multi-platinum singer/songwriter who is also a master improviser. He’s written songs for Snoop Dogg, Rod Stewart, Patti LaBelle, Lana Del Rey, and Bobby Womack. But he also creates songs on the spot at events and conferences, similar to the artists that you sometimes see summarizing keynotes with drawings for example. Let’s take a listen to a sample from Harold’s work.

Harold P.: (Singing).

Dan Gingiss: So I know this sounds cliche, but I actually met Harold in an elevator.

Joey Coleman: This is so classic. It’s like the ultimate elevator music story.

Dan Gingiss: It is. It is. We were actually Joey and I were both at the National Speakers Association Influence Conference in Denver.

Joey Coleman: I was not in the elevator.

Dan Gingiss: Joey was not in the elevator, but I was heading back up to the room, and I met this guy and we shook hands. So we started talking. I said, “So what do you do?” And he says, “Well I sing improv songs for events.” I’m like, “What do you mean?” And he went on to explain it and I thought that he was absolutely fascinating and that we just had to have him on the show. Actually, I asked him to tell us a little bit more about his business in an audio file so that you guys can hear it as well.

Harold P.: So what I do is create customized and sometimes improvise songs for keynotes, events and conferences like that. For example, for the Experience show, I might do something like (singing).

Joey Coleman: I love it because companies often are looking for ways to make their experience more creative or more fun. And while I and Dan both fully understand that the type of music or the improv that Harold is doing here may not be your cup of tea. It’s important to remember that when you’re designing customer experiences, it’s more about what your customers feel than what you feel. So these types of things work. It works for Harold. It works for a lot of other folks out there who are doing creative things to tie together events or add a little spark. I was at a company offsite not too long ago where they brought in somebody who played piano and they did improv. And in my speech I had mentioned a case study that the punchline was root beer. And later on in the evening when the piano player sat down and did a Billy Joel song, The Piano Man, he came to the part where he said, (singing).

And the crowd all thought it was funny and everybody got that it was about me. And it was just this little tiny thing that made it feel special, it created a little moment. And at the end of the day, when we think about customer experience, I think that’s often what it’s about. Just creating a moment, creating a memory, creating something that when the individual who’s been to your event or partook of your conference or come to your office goes back home, there was a funny little interaction or a little jingle in their head that they remember that they can bring back to share with their friends.

Dan Gingiss: Did you put bread in his jar and ask him, man, what are you doing here?

Joey Coleman: I did ask him what he was doing there. Yes, indeed. Indeed.

Dan Gingiss: Well, I love what Harold’s doing and I do think there’s something in it for everyone and he’s so creative about using different musical genres, being able to work with companies or events to prepare songs in advance or to do it in a more improv style where he’s listening to a speech for example. Wouldn’t you love at the end of your keynote to have a song written about what you just spoke about? It’s so cool.

Joey Coleman: I think it’d be a lot of fun and true confessions, I will throw down the gauntlet and challenge myself publicly that I will do this. I have thought about ending a keynote with singing for a long time. I know Dan, you sing in your keynotes regularly. I’ve seen that happen. Dan does a wicked rendition of a song from The Greatest Showman. It’s fantastic. So yeah, I think it could be a lot of fun. And what I like about this, again, this isn’t just about improv singing in events folks. Okay, let’s pull this back to the 35,000-foot level. This is about taking a risk. This is about trying something different. This is about being comfortable with creating a little experience or a little moment that maybe feels awkward or maybe feels not perfectly thought out and executed, but it creates something special and lets them know it’s real. There’s such a trend in all of customer experience to polish the edges and make everything seamless. That’s fine, but it also can have impact if we do something that’s unexpected. It can have impact if we deviate from the path just a little bit as long as it’s a fun experience. Now, Dan and I have discussed doing something like this on the show for the longest time and while we don’t have a full musical episode baked out just yet, what about something like this? Three-four.


Dan Gingiss: (Singing).

Joey Coleman: Wow. Thanks for joining us for another episode of Experience This.

Dan Gingiss: We know there are tons of podcasts to listen to, magazines and books to read, reality TV to watch. We don’t take for granted that you’ve decided to spend some quality time listening to the two of us.

Joey Coleman: We hope you enjoyed our discussions and if you do, we’d love to hear about it. Come on over to and let us know what segments you enjoyed, what new segments you’d like to hear? This show is all about experience, and we want you to be part of the Experience This Show.

Dan Gingiss: Thanks again for your time and we’ll see you next week. For more …

Joey Coleman: Experience …

Dan Gingiss: This.

Episode 61 – Why Your Packaging is Your First Brand Ambassador

Join us as we discuss: whether some customers should get better service than others, the keys to employee learning and development, and how you can use packaging to make a great first impression.

Premium Service, Curriculum and Packaging. Oh my!

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Episode 53 – The Christmas Carol Customer Experience

Enjoy a series of “Christmas carol” variations as we explore call center agent best practices, the downside of a new website, the value of customers, the importance of keeping customers, the impending arrival of AI bots, twelve things to fix in the new year, and a holiday wish for listeners of the Show.

Reindeer, Jingle Bells, and Santa Claus – Oh my!

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Episode 38: How Nespresso Nails the Customer Experience Lifecycle

How Nespresso accounts for every moment in the customer experience lifecycle, the death of cash, and the problem with introducing new technology to your CX.

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Episode 31: How Virtual Reality Will Impact Customer Experience

[The future of virtual reality in the customer experience, the effects of fiction coming to life on the big screen, and how the future is (or isn’t) all about VR.

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Episode 5: Why Trust Is the Difference Between Winning or Losing the CX Game

Getting your customers in the door means winning the first impression, no matter the quality of the product, while getting them to come back means showing them you trust them not to steal anything.

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